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Old 03-26-2008, 08:25 PM   #1
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Default 7 year old raped on school buss. School & Court don't care.

What happens in Vegas stays in Vegas. That’s the motto of the city, but does it also apply to other locations?

While things that happen between consenting adults in Las Vegas are par for the course, a recent news story has raised serious questions about other venues where the Las Vegas motto may apply.

It seems that it’s a free-for-all on public school buses and vans, just like in Las Vegas, except that these are our children and the acts can be far from consensual.

In Ohio, a seven-year-old girl was repeatedly molested, raped and sodomized over a period of at least a year and a half. This is an accepted fact by the court because the emotionally disturbed 16-year-old boy who sexually assaulted the little girl on a special education school van gave a full confession to the police. His confession correlates with what the child reported to her mother, and what her mother reported to the school and the police. He also did not attempt to defend himself in a civil lawsuit brought against him by the victim’s mother.

However, prosecuting the rapist in this case doesn’t go very far in protecting this child and others from sexual predators on school buses. In this case, the school district and the driver of the van do not admit that the sexual attacks even happened. From the driver’s seat of the special education van, the driver cannot see what goes on at the back benches of the 7-passenger van. Since he did not see the attacks, he says that they never happened and that the sexual attacks that the 7-year-old described, and that the 16-year-old confessed to, are the product of the little girl’s imagination. The school district takes the same stance on the issue and stands firm on their position that the child was not raped on the school’s special education van although the 16-year-old has a lengthy rap sheet and school disciplinary record.

To add insult to injury, the mother’s attempt to sue the school district on behalf of her child has failed. A rational person might think and believe that when a child is on a school bus or van, that the school has a duty to protect that child. With this case, we find that is not the case and that the school, by virtue of being a government entity, is immune from liability. Rather than being held to a higher standard, government agencies are instead protected by sovereign immunity.

Initially, a judge in Stark County, Ohio ruled that a jury should hear the case to decide if the school district was negligent. The district, of course, appealed that decision.

The Ohio Court of Appeals recently ruled that the child who was raped has no right to sue the school district. Several courts in Ohio have previously ruled that the operation of school vehicles does not involve protecting the children from harm, including sexual assaults.

Now the child and her mother are waiting to see if the Ohio Supreme Court will hear the case. Although the school district denies that the sexual assaults ever happened, that is not the issue at stake. The real issue is whether or not the school district has a responsibility to ensure the safety of students who rely on transportation provided by the schools. Ohio courts have repeatedly protected the schools by ruling that they do not have a duty to protect students while they are being transported on school buses and vans.

So, unless the Ohio Supreme Court decides otherwise, what happens on school vehicles is of no concern to the school districts. After all, why should they be concerned when the courts say that they aren’t liable?
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Old 03-26-2008, 08:46 PM   #2
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So remind me to make sure I'm on a school bus the next time I want to beat the shit out of or shoot some government official.

Give a knife, an iron and some epinephrine and I'll teach them to change their minds.
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Old 03-26-2008, 08:49 PM   #3
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I have to say that I see the school's and the bus company's point. If I were the parent of the molested child I would probably be down there with a gun but like I said I see their side. Think of how much liability they would face if they were held responsible for everything that happens on those buses.

When I lived in rural southern Illinoins I had to ride a bus and the stuff that went on would result in a million law suits now adays. I am not defending the school or the bus company but if they were held liable just think of how much higher our taxes could go. No one could afford to pay.
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Old 03-26-2008, 08:50 PM   #4
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Damn, thats sad, seems like there would be d. n. a. somewhere on the little girl?
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Old 03-26-2008, 08:56 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by gman32347
I have to say that I see the school's and the bus company's point. If I were the parent of the molested child I would probably be down there with a gun but like I said I see their side. Think of how much liability they would face if they were held responsible for everything that happens on those buses.

When I lived in rural southern Illinoins I had to ride a bus and the stuff that went on would result in a million law suits now adays. I am not defending the school or the bus company but if they were held liable just think of how much higher our taxes could go. No one could afford to pay.


I see their point too but there should be a difference in liability for the normal crazy crap that kids do on a bus (it doesn't even have seat belts) and something like this. I think it's another example of how the screwed up justice system, where you can sue over people's own stupidity, has resulted in real crimes going unpunished.
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Old 03-26-2008, 09:39 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Meadow
What happens in Vegas stays in Vegas. That’s the motto of the city, but does it also apply to other locations?

While things that happen between consenting adults in Las Vegas are par for the course, a recent news story has raised serious questions about other venues where the Las Vegas motto may apply.

It seems that it’s a free-for-all on public school buses and vans, just like in Las Vegas, except that these are our children and the acts can be far from consensual.
A seven-year-old girl being raped is already bad. Why do they have to add this stupid rhetoric about Las Vegas and such. These first three paragraphs serve no purpose other than to cause fear in the readers.

For crying out loud, can't the story stand on its own without cheap sensationalism? I'm surprised the headline wasn't "THE GOVERNMENT WANTS YOUR CHILDREN TO BE RAPED ON THE SCHOOLBUS!" That would sure draw in the readers.

As far as the actual story goes, it's kind of disturbing. If I were the parent, I would be incredibly upset. But from a busdriver's point of view, how much control can they really exert over the passengers? It's their job to drive at watch the road, not to know what might being going on in the back seat. Then again, one would think that would be much easier to monitor in a seven passenger van than in a full length bus, so I don't know.
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Old 03-26-2008, 10:00 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by xanprime
A seven-year-old girl being raped is already bad. Why do they have to add this stupid rhetoric about Las Vegas and such. These first three paragraphs serve no purpose other than to cause fear in the readers.

For crying out loud, can't the story stand on its own without cheap sensationalism? I'm surprised the headline wasn't "THE GOVERNMENT WANTS YOUR CHILDREN TO BE RAPED ON THE SCHOOLBUS!" That would sure draw in the readers.
Should I change the title? I just did the whole copy paste stuff. I dont see why just because it happened in Vegas makes a difference either.


Quote:
Originally Posted by xanprime
As far as the actual story goes, it's kind of disturbing. If I were the parent, I would be incredibly upset. But from a busdriver's point of view, how much control can they really exert over the passengers? It's their job to drive at watch the road, not to know what might being going on in the back seat. Then again, one would think that would be much easier to monitor in a seven passenger van than in a full length bus, so I don't know.

Well, it said the 16 year old boy was mentally challanged. He SHOULD have been on the special buss in my opinion. I also think ALL busses should have a teachers aid.
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Old 03-26-2008, 10:03 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Meadow
Should I change the title? I just did the whole copy paste stuff. I dont see why just because it happened in Vegas makes a difference either.
No, I'm sorry, I wasn't clear. My criticism was directed at the news agency, not at you.
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Old 03-26-2008, 10:31 PM   #9
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No, I'm sorry, I wasn't clear. My criticism was directed at the news agency, not at you.

Quite right. They are looking for sensationalism. You are forwarding news.
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Old 03-26-2008, 10:42 PM   #10
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School Districts are claiming their budgets are stretched too far as it is. Elementary students are walking miles, sometimes even across four-lane highways, to get to school so the district can save money... and now some people want the districts to provide more security/surveillance for the ones who do ride buses? If I were on a school board and this suggestion was raised, I would just say, "Fine. No buses for anyone. That should solve everything."

Do you think the children walking to school should have the protection of the school district, too?

Seriously, how far does this go?

You want to ensure your child's safety on their way to and from school? Either walk with them, give them a ride, or arrange a ride with someone you trust.

For the school district and bus driver to deny the incidents even happened is a bit out there, but to expect them to do anything about it is equally so. If anything, that's what we pay the police for, not the schools.

My $.02.
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Old 03-26-2008, 10:50 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by xanprime
...from a busdriver's point of view, how much control can they really exert over the passengers?
When I was in school if any kids played up the bus driver would either tell us off or KICK us off & that was a 6 mile drive.

As to the buses or school not having any responsibility I believe they do. If it were a public bus in which patrons who are not students could get on & off then they wouldn't. But, this isn't a public bus (the way I read it anyway) It is a service provided solely for the children of the school therefore (IMO) there should by a duty of care towards those children otherwise the school should say to parents "Pick your children up or let find their own way home as there are no services that are given for just our school"

Quote:
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...it said the 16 year old boy was mentally challanged....
No it said he is emotionally disturbed... although it does say "Special Education Van" which begs the question as to what kind of school it is & what carrying capabilities the van has... for instance if it's got wheelchair access then it shows that the bus is provided specifically for the purpose of carrying those children & the bus driver must be trained to handle mentally or bodily disabled people.

Unless I'm severely mistaken....
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Old 03-26-2008, 11:01 PM   #12
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Now I'm confused... is it a special education school, or is it a school van for special education students? And if the latter... I've never heard of such a van not having an extra adult chaperon, in addition to the bus driver. If this bus didn't... why?

Ultimately, though, if the bus driver truly didn't know what was happening (I think that while it's important for a driver to pay attention to the students, it's more important for him to pay attention to the road), then the bus driver and the busing agency cannot be held responsible, and I still fail to see how this is actually the school district's responsibility at all... but, I also don't want to pay higher taxes just so they can pay an extra adult or two to ride each bus with the kids, who may or may not actually do anything to make the ride "more secure" for the kids... let alone also pay for extra security for the students who walk to school.
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Old 03-26-2008, 11:40 PM   #13
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While I'm with ya on the whole "Driver needs to pay attention on the road" he also needs to make sure his passengers are safe. Maybe a bus driver can write their interpretations of this here but I do think it odd that s/he didn't notice this going on for a year & a half which makes me concerned for their eyesight in even seeing the road! To clarify, the bus is a SEVEN seater... that's a TARAGO!

The bus I took to & from school each day had a capacity of 50-60 people & I STILL remember a bus driver stopping his bus walking to where I was sitting (at the back) to tell me to put the lid on the bottle or get the hell off his bus! (no food/drink policy)

Bare in mind, the bus had every seat full and he saw me in a mirror sipping my coca-cola from around 6 metres. Which makes me wonder how someone can miss seeing someone (what about hearing?) sodomising another person at a distance of maybe 2 metres.

It's all confusing & this is gonna be another two way argument but I've said my piece. Hope the girl sees some justice
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Old 03-27-2008, 12:14 AM   #14
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Hope the girl sees some justice
She already has. The rapist has already been successfully prosecuted. The problem is, some people want others to take some responsibility in the case, including the girl's mother. I say if the rapist has confessed and been prosecuted, then the issue should be dropped.

Edit: Don't get me wrong. I think the rapist's actions are simply reprehensible, and I still don't see how the bus driver didn't know, and/or have an aide who should have known. I'm just saying, if he didn't, then I don't see how he can be held responsible, and whether he did or not, I don't believe the School District should be held responsible.
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Old 03-27-2008, 12:17 AM   #15
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Ugh...

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Old 03-27-2008, 12:49 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xanprime
No, I'm sorry, I wasn't clear. My criticism was directed at the news agency, not at you.

Xan's right that is really crappy journalism I can see the effect they were going for (drop intro where the story starts after the first paragraph) however that type of intro isn't really appropriate for a hard news story like this.

Back on topic it is suprising that the bus driver didn't notice what was going on though as others have said that they may be doing that to cover their backs as it were.
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Old 03-27-2008, 02:18 AM   #17
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QFT Dan, took the words right out of my mouth.
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Old 03-27-2008, 04:31 AM   #18
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fucking terrible.


sick to my stomach
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Old 03-27-2008, 11:54 AM   #19
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Aren't most of the special needs buses the shorter wheelbase?

How can you not see what's going on some of the time? If this occurred for over a year then the driver must know. If it's true then this is SICK
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Old 03-27-2008, 12:54 PM   #20
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The short busses in the area I went to school in had Buss Aids... and someone tried to get me a buss aid job here in Arizona... must mean its at least in two states.

Every buss I've ever been on had better coveradge then this buss had.
I'm confused why the little girl didnt yell or anything, but maybe it was just cuz she was scared. *shrugs*
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